posted 07-10-2006 11:54 AM ET (US)        

Here is a link explaining this type of anchoring in detail:

http://www.marinews.com/boat_article_details.php?recordid=41

Has anybody here tried this before?

Rex Hunt is Australian and the article in the link is from an Australian boating site. Seems like a technique they use often down-under.

posted 07-10-2006 12:49 PM ET (US)            

That is a very common accessory on boats that fish wrecks and man-made reefs in the Gulf of Mexico. They are sold by most of the larger chandlery chains (West marine, etc.), and are nothing more than a round bouy or fender with a ring and shackle at the other end of about an 18" length of line.

My first exposure to one of these was a couple of years ago about 40 miles off of Apalachicola Florida fishing in my Outrage 22 with a couple of good old boys who knew the territory in their 25' World Cat. We were fishing (anchored) over an abandoned oil well template that rose up to about 90' deep in around 140' of water, and as the day wore on the wind built and it got a little choppy. When it came time to leave, my anchor (a danforth - the "pros" use wreck anchors that look like grappling hooks) turned out to be absolutely and seemingly irretrievably stuck in the framework of the old template. It would slide up and down about 10', and that was it. I tried everything I knew, and battling the building seas, I was starting to contemplate cutting the anchor line. Then my partners in the World Cat came over and tossed us one of those devices and told me to clip it to the anchor line, then let out all my line and circle the stuck anchor. They said the anchor retriever would "go down and get my anchor". Well this yankee knew better than that. But by damn if that isn't exactly what happened! The bouy was pulled down out of site, and the next thing I knew, there was the anchor with its shank through the ring of the retriever, floating at the surface, ready to be pulled aboard!

I have an anchor retriever of my own now, and I don't go out for that type of fishing without it.

posted 07-10-2006 02:00 PM ET (US)            

Erik

posted 07-10-2006 02:45 PM ET (US)            

That's only a good idea if you don't rely on your anchor to keep you put while sleeping.

The retainer line could break in the middle of the night and unset the anchor. You could then awake to find yourself bashed against the rocks, or drifting in the middle of the sea-lanes.

posted 07-10-2006 03:24 PM ET (US)            

You're right.
But you have to test and and try for the right line.
I admit I use to dive or fishand not sleep all night with this.
But it helps when you just have to anchor for two hours.
I have saved some anchors that way.
That was just my 0.02 cents.

Regards

posted 07-10-2006 04:38 PM ET (US)            

If your boat is big enough to require an anchor that is hard to lift, it's big enough to have a windlass.

posted 07-10-2006 05:51 PM ET (US)            

Coming from the big-boat world, I tend to think of a windlass as being a basic piece of equipment that nearly every boat has. Virtually every production boat over 25' comes from the factory with one these days. I certainly remember when that wasn't the case, but pulling the anchor up by hand was never much of a problem for me, even on a 30' sailboat with a heavy steal danforth.

posted 07-10-2006 06:43 PM ET (US)            

The simplest, safest, and easiest way to unfoul an anchor is to use a retrieval line. That will work virtually every time, with minimal effort. If not, you have obviously become very extremely fouled and no mount of moving around will help, with or without the buoy, and your only option is to either dive for the anchor or cut it free and replace it.

No boat under 25' should need to carry an anchor too heavy to manually lift, unless the operator is elderly, or suffering from a disability, in which case, one would hope that they have an able-bodied deckhand with them.

Perhaps there is a confusion about the use of the word "fouled". To me, a fouled anchor is one which has snagged it's flukes on something which is too heavy to lift along with the anchor, such as a sunken log, an abandoned anchor chain from a larger, long-gone boat, or a stray steel cable (common here from decades of large scale logging operations). I fail to see how this method would do anything to unfoul an anchor. It certainly wouldn't be any easier than simply giving a retrieval line a solid tug.

posted 07-10-2006 08:00 PM ET (US)            

I'm not interested in fighting for the soapbox or preaching to the lost.

So if you don't think these retrievers work as I've described, or if you think you have a system that works better, I repeat what I said above: you'd be foolish to spend your money on one. End of story.

Me, I'm ambling back to where I was when I responded to Erik's initial post, in what was intended to be a friendly and relevent way.

Erik, I have used one of these before, and I was impressed enough by how it worked that I now own one of my own, and I'm glad I bought it.

posted 07-10-2006 09:15 PM ET (US)            

I have never used one of these anchor retrieval systems, but have seen them in use and they are an amazing way to effortlessly retrieve an anchor. It's certainly much easier to pull in your anchor and line when the anchor is floating on the surface. I have planned on purchasing one for some time, just haven't yet.

I am constantly amazed at some people on this site who discredit obviously experienced boaters when the discussion involves something they know absolutely nothing about.

Steve

posted 07-11-2006 12:53 PM ET (US)            

I'm not trying to take the soapbox, I'm just trying to get a clear picture of how this thing works. If it does what I'm picturing, I guess it takes some of the effort out of lifting the anchor, but at great risk not only to divers and passengers, but also of becoming snagged on bottom debris, which seems to me to make it LESS desirable for use by divers around wrecks, rather than more.

From what I'm picturing, it seems like more traditional methods (retrieval line, bow roller and a windlass) make a lot more sense for accomplishing all the same things with much less risk.

But again, I've read the descriptions as carefully as I can, and followed all the links, but I still figure I must not get it. If you guys swear by it, and experienced captains use it regularly, it MUST not work the way I'm picturing. So please, someone explain it better.

What I'm picturing is a float that attaches to the the anchor line and can slide freely along it. To lift the anchor you attach this float to the anchor line and gun the engine, leaving the anchor line attached to the boat (but moving it to the stern, I guess, which seems dangerous in and of itself to me) The float then travels down the line, being drug by resistance in the water, and it's buoyancy lifts the anchor somewhat vertically. Once the anchor is at the surface, it basically drags behind the boat, with the chain portion becoming entangled in the float and you then bring in the anchor line like you would a waterski rope, rather than lifting it vertically.

posted 07-11-2006 01:22 PM ET (US)            

When my anchor is fouled on something on the bottom and I am unable to retrieve it in any other way, I snap the ring around the anchor line, throw the retriever bouy in the water, let out all the anchor line if it is not already out, and idle (or fast idle) in a circle around the spot where the anchor is fouled, close to the limit of the anchor line. I've yet to have to go further than one complete circle before the anchor is freed.

posted 07-11-2006 03:37 PM ET (US)            

The two links I provided above give fairly detailed directions.

To use the Anchor Ring system I just:
* remove the ring and buoy from the forward locker
* attach it to the anchor line and throw it over
* drive the boat slowly at a slight angle in the direction of the anchor (Depending on which set of instructions you use the suggested speed is 5-8 knots and the angle is up to 30 degrees off of the anchor. The buoy makes it easy to see where the line is so you don't run it over.)
* once the anchor is on the surface I just put the engines in neutral and pull it in (My boat will drift with the stern toward the wind and waves and the bow pointed back toward the buoy with the anchor on it.)

posted 07-11-2006 05:34 PM ET (US)            

If you're anchoring in 100-200' of water with a danforth, you should really have more than 20' of chain. A danforth requires about 1/4 to 1/3 of the line deployed to be chain in order to hold a set. At 5:1 scope in 100' of water, that's 125' of chain. I suppose you could get away with 50' if you ran 6 or 7 to 1 scope in order to lower the angle. But in order for a danforth to hold, the chain needs to be puling perfectly laterally on the shaft. The slightest upward pull will unset the anchor. This is why I don't use a danforth.

posted 07-11-2006 05:37 PM ET (US)            

Following is an edited quote from one of my earlier posts in this thread, that describes to the best of my ability how *I* use my anchor retriever:

When my anchor is fouled on something on the bottom and I am unable to retrieve it in any other way (or I am not interested in trying anything else), I snap the ring around the anchor line, and throw the retriever bouy in the water. I make sure the bitter end is tied off to the bow lifting ring then let out all the anchor line if it is not already out and snub the anchor line to one of my bow cleats. Then I idle (or fast idle) in a circle around the spot where the anchor is fouled, close to the limit of the anchor line. The bouy submerges sometime during this part. I've yet to have to go further than one complete circle before the anchor is freed. When the bouy pops back up to the surface, I straighten the path of the boat out (keeping a slight angle so I don't foul the anchor line in the prop) until the bouy is clearly following the boat; the anchor is then hanging from the bouy with the shank through the retriever ring. The anchor line could easly be cleatd off amidships or aft.

posted 07-14-2006 12:10 PM ET (US)            

quote:

---

If you're anchoring in 100-200' of water with a danforth, you should really have more than 20' of chain. A danforth requires about 1/4 to 1/3 of the line deployed to be chain in order to hold a set.

---

posted 07-14-2006 01:16 PM ET (US)            

I use the method mentioned further up. I use a small plastic ZIP tie to my Bruce anchor and have the shackle at the elbow. That way, if I'm truly stuck on the bottom or on anything, I can tug very hard and break that ZIP tie and retrieve the anchor. I've needed to use it once.

I don't worry much about breaking anchor and drifting into shipping lanes, etc, because if I were sleeping aboard in conditions that would put that much strain on the anchor; 1. I would not be able to sleep and 2. I'd put out a second anchor, my danforth.