Trailer Brakes: Change to Disc from Drum Brakes

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Author Topic:   Trailer Brakes: Change to Disc from Drum Brakes

dspinosa posted 05-31-2009 02:58 PM ET (US)
I am looking for advice on replacing the brakes on my trailer. Should I stay with drum or change to discs[?] Any info would be greatly appreciated.
dan
Irish Hooker posted 05-31-2009 07:46 PM ET (US)
I would look at what you tow with, the terrain you tow on and what you tow. Does your trailer stop well with drums and your truck? Are you going downhill a lot? Also resale, people like the discs.
I just replaced my disc brakes on my tandem trailer. They tried to talk me into converting to drum because I was bummed on the price but I opted for sticking with discs. The main thing was safety and ease of maintenance. They said they could put in a flush kit with the drums, but I knew I wouldn't flush them every time. I dip the trailer in the salt so just giving the discs a good spray along with the boat is worth it to me. My trailer guy gave a good argument though, "Drum brakes have been around for a long time, and will be around for a long time, because they work."
IH
Dan posted 05-31-2009 08:18 PM ET (US)
Get disc brakes!
jimh posted 05-31-2009 10:04 PM ET (US)
I was faced with this same decision last spring. My trailer brakes needed to be overhauled. I had drum brakes with a surge actuator. I gave considerable thought to all possibilities. As I saw it, my choices were:
BRAKES:
--disc
--drum
ACTUATOR
--surge
--electric
I decided to retain the existing drum brake system with the existing surge actuator. I replaced the drum brakes on all four wheels.
If you have drum brakes and you have a surge actuator, you will have to replace the actuator or modify the existing actuator to change to disc brakes. This will add to the cost.
The nature of your boating is an influence. If you boat in tropical saltwater and you frequently launch and load your boat on the trailer, you may wish to invest more money in the brake system to get the longest lasting and lowest maintenance system possible. In my case, my main use of my trailer is in cold freshwater, and the resistance to corrosion is not a major factor. My last set of brakes lasted 16 years. The failure occurred only after a week in tropical saltwater.
The ultimate brake system is probably composed of an electrically operated actuator driven from an advance brake controller in the truck, with the electric actuator driving a hydraulic disc brake system composed of high-end corrosion resistant disc brakes. However, a system like that can be very expensive.
andygere posted 05-31-2009 11:30 PM ET (US)
It depends how much you enjoy working on your trailer. If you think it's fun, go with the drums and enjoy the experience every year or so. If you'd rather spend your weekends boating and fishing, put on a set of Kodiak disc brakes and be done with it once and for all. I learned this lesson the hard way, but finally saw the light. Converting to disc brakes is easy, and well worth the expense.
Lil Whaler Lover posted 06-01-2009 08:12 AM ET (US)
Freshwater use either, but disc are better.
Saltwater use Disc only.
Parts are not interchangeable, so disc will need everything new. Less labor on disc though.
andygere posted 06-01-2009 03:24 PM ET (US)
It is very easy to modify the surge actuator (master cylinder) originally set up for drum brakes so it works on disc brakes. A diaphragm is pierced, and a solenoid valve to redirect flow back into the master cylinder is added. Most surge couplers are already plumbed for the return line. The purpose of this modification is to prevent the disc brakes from actuating when moving in reverse. Drum brakes are free backing, and do not need this modification.
In theory, your brake lines can all be reused, but my experience is that many components, especially the flexible lines, will be ready for replacement anyway. Cheaper OEM systems often use steel brake lines in lieu of stainless steel, and those should be replaced regardless of what type of brakes you decide to use.
A good source for technical articles related to various trailer braking systems is found here: http://www.championtrailers.com/techsup.html#techretro
Before I switched to Kodiak disc brakes, I was using Tie-Down brand drum brake assemblies, components of which are treated with Galv-X or some such corrosion resistant material. They rusted up just as fast as the mild steel versions that came before them. I have a saltwater slip, and so my trailer only gets used (meaning dunked in the salt) 2-4 times per year. Invariably, at the most inopportune time, I'd hook the trailer up to the truck to go get the boat (or if I was particularly unlucky, to go launch the boat) and find at least one of the wheels frozen due to rust on the backing plate assembly, star adjusters, wheel cylinder or the drums themselves.
I purchased a Kodiak disk brake kit that utilizes stainless steel for all of the components except for the rotors. Cast iron dissipates heat much better than stainless steel, and rust on the rotors is not a problem. The rotors are silver cadmium plated, so non contact parts have a good deal of corrosion resistance. The trailer sat from November to May this year, and the brakes performed flawlessly right out of the driveway. The difference is stopping power of the disc brakes should not be ignored either. They are superior to the drums in this regard.
BW23 posted 06-02-2009 04:00 PM ET (US)
If you decide on discs, only buy KODIAK's !
Don't waste your time on Tie-Downs.
Buckda posted 06-02-2009 04:08 PM ET (US)
Question: When installing brakes for the first time on a trailer, do you need a special type of axle, or just a new hub assembly?
Thanks!
PATXBill posted 06-02-2009 08:34 PM ET (US)
Discs all the way. I just made the change and I'm glad I did. Swapped out the axle (one of mine broke as I pulled in my driveway) and added discs, new lines, and new actuator. Planning on doing the same to my second axle in fall/winter.
Buckda, if the axle never had brakes it usually won't have brake flanges--a square piece of metal to mount the brake assembly, disc or drum. You'll probably need to add the brake flanges--an easy job for a welder assuming your axle is in good condition. If you have significant corrosion, swap out the axle and have peace of mind.
andygere posted 06-03-2009 12:48 AM ET (US)
Photos coming your way.
andygere posted 06-03-2009 12:49 AM ET (US)
Uh, that would be Buckda's way.
andygere posted 06-03-2009 01:07 AM ET (US)
OK, I'll share. Descriptions are with the pix.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3893.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3895.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3899.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3903.jpg
[urlhttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/IMG_3902.jpg][/url]
andygere posted 06-03-2009 01:08 AM ET (US)
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ ?albumview=grid
Buckda posted 06-03-2009 08:57 AM ET (US)
Thanks guys. I weighed my rig this spring and realized that I am way over the limit for operation without trailer brakes. I have an unemployed friend (who in Michigan doesn't?) who is a competent welder with the right equipment for steel welding that I will approach with this. The trailer never had brakes, so I imagine I'm going to be in for an approximate $500-$700 upgrade...yikes.
PeteB88 posted 06-03-2009 11:19 AM ET (US)
How much is a new axle w/ brakes or attachments?
andygere posted 06-03-2009 11:22 AM ET (US)
If you are welding flanges to an existing axle, be sure they are located correctly. This is a fairly close tolerance part, since the caliper bracket mounts to the flange, and it the caliper must straddle the rotor correctly. Your estimate on costs are in the ballpark for a single axle.
I didn't mention it earlier, but I really like the Tie Down disc brake actuator/coupler (model 70E) that I installed. It has an integral reversing solenoid that's protected by the steel housing, a beefy coupler with safety lock pin, and it's easy to bleed using a screwdriver. I also like that it bolts to the trailer frame with three bolts instead of the usual two. Although my older Attwood coupler could have been easily retrofit for disc brakes, I was happy to get rid of it. It was difficult to bleed, impossible to secure with a shackle protected padlock, the actuator action was not linear (it pivoted), which led to poor handling characteristics on hard stops, and the coupler mechanism itself was always balky. It works fine, however, and can be had for free to anyone willing to pay the shipping or pick it up directly.
andygere posted 06-03-2009 11:25 AM ET (US)

quote:
How much is a new axle w/ brakes or attachments?
About $200 for a galvanized 3500 pound 2"x2" axle with brake flanges.

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Author	Topic: Trailer Brakes: Change to Disc from Drum Brakes
dspinosa	posted 05-31-2009 02:58 PM ET (US) I am looking for advice on replacing the brakes on my trailer. Should I stay with drum or change to discs[?] Any info would be greatly appreciated. dan
Irish Hooker	posted 05-31-2009 07:46 PM ET (US) I would look at what you tow with, the terrain you tow on and what you tow. Does your trailer stop well with drums and your truck? Are you going downhill a lot? Also resale, people like the discs. I just replaced my disc brakes on my tandem trailer. They tried to talk me into converting to drum because I was bummed on the price but I opted for sticking with discs. The main thing was safety and ease of maintenance. They said they could put in a flush kit with the drums, but I knew I wouldn't flush them every time. I dip the trailer in the salt so just giving the discs a good spray along with the boat is worth it to me. My trailer guy gave a good argument though, "Drum brakes have been around for a long time, and will be around for a long time, because they work." IH
Dan	posted 05-31-2009 08:18 PM ET (US) Get disc brakes!
jimh	posted 05-31-2009 10:04 PM ET (US) I was faced with this same decision last spring. My trailer brakes needed to be overhauled. I had drum brakes with a surge actuator. I gave considerable thought to all possibilities. As I saw it, my choices were: BRAKES: --disc --drum ACTUATOR --surge --electric I decided to retain the existing drum brake system with the existing surge actuator. I replaced the drum brakes on all four wheels. If you have drum brakes and you have a surge actuator, you will have to replace the actuator or modify the existing actuator to change to disc brakes. This will add to the cost. The nature of your boating is an influence. If you boat in tropical saltwater and you frequently launch and load your boat on the trailer, you may wish to invest more money in the brake system to get the longest lasting and lowest maintenance system possible. In my case, my main use of my trailer is in cold freshwater, and the resistance to corrosion is not a major factor. My last set of brakes lasted 16 years. The failure occurred only after a week in tropical saltwater. The ultimate brake system is probably composed of an electrically operated actuator driven from an advance brake controller in the truck, with the electric actuator driving a hydraulic disc brake system composed of high-end corrosion resistant disc brakes. However, a system like that can be very expensive.
andygere	posted 05-31-2009 11:30 PM ET (US) It depends how much you enjoy working on your trailer. If you think it's fun, go with the drums and enjoy the experience every year or so. If you'd rather spend your weekends boating and fishing, put on a set of Kodiak disc brakes and be done with it once and for all. I learned this lesson the hard way, but finally saw the light. Converting to disc brakes is easy, and well worth the expense.
Lil Whaler Lover	posted 06-01-2009 08:12 AM ET (US) Freshwater use either, but disc are better. Saltwater use Disc only. Parts are not interchangeable, so disc will need everything new. Less labor on disc though.
andygere	posted 06-01-2009 03:24 PM ET (US) It is very easy to modify the surge actuator (master cylinder) originally set up for drum brakes so it works on disc brakes. A diaphragm is pierced, and a solenoid valve to redirect flow back into the master cylinder is added. Most surge couplers are already plumbed for the return line. The purpose of this modification is to prevent the disc brakes from actuating when moving in reverse. Drum brakes are free backing, and do not need this modification. In theory, your brake lines can all be reused, but my experience is that many components, especially the flexible lines, will be ready for replacement anyway. Cheaper OEM systems often use steel brake lines in lieu of stainless steel, and those should be replaced regardless of what type of brakes you decide to use. A good source for technical articles related to various trailer braking systems is found here: http://www.championtrailers.com/techsup.html#techretro Before I switched to Kodiak disc brakes, I was using Tie-Down brand drum brake assemblies, components of which are treated with Galv-X or some such corrosion resistant material. They rusted up just as fast as the mild steel versions that came before them. I have a saltwater slip, and so my trailer only gets used (meaning dunked in the salt) 2-4 times per year. Invariably, at the most inopportune time, I'd hook the trailer up to the truck to go get the boat (or if I was particularly unlucky, to go launch the boat) and find at least one of the wheels frozen due to rust on the backing plate assembly, star adjusters, wheel cylinder or the drums themselves. I purchased a Kodiak disk brake kit that utilizes stainless steel for all of the components except for the rotors. Cast iron dissipates heat much better than stainless steel, and rust on the rotors is not a problem. The rotors are silver cadmium plated, so non contact parts have a good deal of corrosion resistance. The trailer sat from November to May this year, and the brakes performed flawlessly right out of the driveway. The difference is stopping power of the disc brakes should not be ignored either. They are superior to the drums in this regard.
BW23	posted 06-02-2009 04:00 PM ET (US) If you decide on discs, only buy KODIAK's ! Don't waste your time on Tie-Downs.
Buckda	posted 06-02-2009 04:08 PM ET (US) Question: When installing brakes for the first time on a trailer, do you need a special type of axle, or just a new hub assembly? Thanks!
PATXBill	posted 06-02-2009 08:34 PM ET (US) Discs all the way. I just made the change and I'm glad I did. Swapped out the axle (one of mine broke as I pulled in my driveway) and added discs, new lines, and new actuator. Planning on doing the same to my second axle in fall/winter. Buckda, if the axle never had brakes it usually won't have brake flanges--a square piece of metal to mount the brake assembly, disc or drum. You'll probably need to add the brake flanges--an easy job for a welder assuming your axle is in good condition. If you have significant corrosion, swap out the axle and have peace of mind.
andygere	posted 06-03-2009 12:48 AM ET (US) Photos coming your way.
andygere	posted 06-03-2009 12:49 AM ET (US) Uh, that would be Buckda's way.
andygere	posted 06-03-2009 01:07 AM ET (US) OK, I'll share. Descriptions are with the pix. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3893.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3895.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3899.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ IMG_3903.jpg [urlhttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/IMG_3902.jpg][/url]
andygere	posted 06-03-2009 01:08 AM ET (US) http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Kodiak%20Brakes/ ?albumview=grid
Buckda	posted 06-03-2009 08:57 AM ET (US) Thanks guys. I weighed my rig this spring and realized that I am way over the limit for operation without trailer brakes. I have an unemployed friend (who in Michigan doesn't?) who is a competent welder with the right equipment for steel welding that I will approach with this. The trailer never had brakes, so I imagine I'm going to be in for an approximate $500-$700 upgrade...yikes.
PeteB88	posted 06-03-2009 11:19 AM ET (US) How much is a new axle w/ brakes or attachments?
andygere	posted 06-03-2009 11:22 AM ET (US) If you are welding flanges to an existing axle, be sure they are located correctly. This is a fairly close tolerance part, since the caliper bracket mounts to the flange, and it the caliper must straddle the rotor correctly. Your estimate on costs are in the ballpark for a single axle. I didn't mention it earlier, but I really like the Tie Down disc brake actuator/coupler (model 70E) that I installed. It has an integral reversing solenoid that's protected by the steel housing, a beefy coupler with safety lock pin, and it's easy to bleed using a screwdriver. I also like that it bolts to the trailer frame with three bolts instead of the usual two. Although my older Attwood coupler could have been easily retrofit for disc brakes, I was happy to get rid of it. It was difficult to bleed, impossible to secure with a shackle protected padlock, the actuator action was not linear (it pivoted), which led to poor handling characteristics on hard stops, and the coupler mechanism itself was always balky. It works fine, however, and can be had for free to anyone willing to pay the shipping or pick it up directly.
andygere	posted 06-03-2009 11:25 AM ET (US) quote: How much is a new axle w/ brakes or attachments? About $200 for a galvanized 3500 pound 2"x2" axle with brake flanges.