Reliability of Outboard Motors With Rebuilt Power Head

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Author Topic:   Reliability of Outboard Motors With Rebuilt Power Head

NJCoastFlyFish posted 05-02-2010 10:22 AM ET (US)
I have been looking around for a used outboard for a 21-foot boat. I want your thoughts on the reliability of a used outboard with a new powerhead. I am having a problem buying an outboard with a new powerhead because there is a reason the power head failed in the first place. Am I wrong? Can a power head actually just fail from normal use? Is that normal after say 1,500-hours, 2,000-hour? I am under the assumption that power heads fail from running hot without oil for an extended period of time.
[If] you bought a used outboard that has 1,500-hours on it with a new powerhead that has 0-hours on it, from personal experience, have any of you actually gotten another 1,500-hours out of your new-used outboard before another repair? Do the rest of the systems on the outboard usually fail first and provide more of a headache?
Like I said, I am in the process of buying a used outboard but I am a little biased against these new-power-head engines with big price tags. What are your thoughts?
Here is a scenario with two outboards, which one would you pick: 1999 Yamaha 150-HP two-cycle 600-hours runs great $2500, or 1999 Yamaha 150-HP two-cycle new 0-hour powerhead, 1,000-hours on rest of engine $4500?
tom976 posted 05-02-2010 11:16 AM ET (US)
Engines with new powerheads can be fine for many years. You have to look at it in a different way.We can all relate to cars. Some cars are built and designed better than others--same with outboards. Some cars can go 200,000 miles and still run strong; others not--same with outboards. What matters the most with a car or outboard is maintenance. If [previous owner] kept on top of things that need to get done it'll last.
Two-cycle uutboard failures can occur from overheating [due] to lack of lubrication. Somethings things just age or get worn and let go inside. As for the Yamaha motors you listed, [if] those are OX66 motors, they were well designed and reliable motors. Some claim to get a few thousand hours on them. The problem that you have is that those motors never had an internal hour meter on them, so when someone says 600-hours, it [is] like me selling a car with a broken speedometer stuck on 10,000 miles. It might be 10,000 or 210,000. You never know.
As for a powerhead that is new, that can last you a long time. The lower unit will need to be serviced or replaced down the road but that [is] [an] $800 item. New they're about $1,200 on [on-line auction websites])
The rebuilt versus new power head can be dicey too. Some define rebuilt as replacing the items that failed; others replace from soup to nuts the internals. All depends on who does it. Generally speaking though a replacement powerhead from places like [online seller] can run around $3000 or so. So if the motor with 0 hours and new power head were $4,500 it [is] not a bad deal. Especially if they'll throw in a one-year warranty. Generally speaking, it it doesn't break within the first year, take care of it and it should last awhile. For the same motor with 600-hours, it may have [unclear], maybe not. For say $1,500 [unclear] might be worth the risk since putting on a new power head would cost you the same if you had to replace the one on the used motor.
Hope this helps.
One more thing: The one thing that some boaters worry about is reliability especially if going offshore. If you like to go 30-miles off shore, then some would choose a rebuilt motor. If you just like going in the back bays or a few miles out, then the used one might be a better choice. Nobody wants to get stuck 30 miles out with no easy way to get back. Inshore boats with older engines get peace of mind from [towing services]--best $150 you'll spend all year in my opinion.--Tom
jimh posted 05-02-2010 11:35 AM ET (US)
When an outboard motor power head is re-built, you are essentially making a large investment in the skill of the person performing the re-build. If you know the person who performed the re-build of the motor, and if you have confidence in his skill at performing a re-build of an outboard motor, you should not be afraid of buying a motor re-built by that person.
If you know nothing about the skill of the person who re-built the motor, you really know nothing about the motor.
NJCoastFlyFish posted 05-03-2010 07:53 AM ET (US)
If two stroke outboards fail from lack of lubrication how do four stroke powerheads fail? If the engine oiling system in a four stroke is a closed system and there is always oil in the engine can the powerhead still fail?
Lets say for argument sake you found a nice outboard with a new powerhead but don't know who put the powerhead on. Is there anything you can do to test the workmanship of the installation? Would a certified mechanic be able to look at it on the spot and give a general idea on how well it was done or does the engine need tearing into in order to tell?
Jefecinco posted 05-03-2010 09:33 AM ET (US)
There is a huge difference between a "new" and a "rebuilt" power head. The terms are not interchangeable.
A new power head is available from the manufacturer and is from the same assembly line that produces new complete engines. It's as good as new. A rebuilt power head is exactly as described by JimH. It is as good as the person performing the rebuild. If you are ignorant of the source you are ignorant of the result.
If a new power head has been installed on an old engine there is a reasonable assumption that it was assembled correctly. It can be examined and tested by a reliable shop for added assurance. If you are nervous about it have it checked out. For a rebuilt power head read the previous paragraph.
It is not a reasonable assumption that all outboard engine failures are due to over heating. It is unusual for a four stroke outboard engine to be rebuilt or, if the engine suffered a serious failure, to be repaired. The cost of rebuild or serious internal engine repair of a four stroke outboard engine is much higher than for a two stroke outboard engine.
Buying a used engine from an unknown source is a roll of the dice. If I was in the market for a used two stroke the price would have to be low because I would assume I would have to rebuild the engine at any time. An engine with a rebuilt power head would be subject to the same assumption. I could make an exception in the case of an engine from a source well know to me when I knew the engine had had the proper care.
Butch
adlert posted 05-03-2010 10:00 AM ET (US)
NJ,
Not really. jimh is spot on. Likely the "new" powerhead is not a factory assembled new powerhead but a remanufactured unit. If a factory supplied unit I'd be pleasantly surprised but demand verification. If not the powerhead could have come from a variety of sources, the most likely being one of the many large powerhead rebuilding companies (and then installed by a more local mechanic). Or possibly the local mechanic did the entire rebuilding and installation job him/herself.
In principle, a properly rebuilt powerhead is essentially just as good as a new one and should last accordingly. In reality, I feel the large engine rebuilders often do not take the time to assemble their rebuilds to factory original tolerances. At these shops it is reasonably safe to assume that all cylinder walls will be restored as necessary, bearings, seals and pistons will be replaced; but it is not a gaurantee that a so-so crankshaft or connecting rod returned as a core from the last customer won't find its way into the newly rebuilt unit as a cost saving measure to maintain profitability in this very competitive business. I feel that proper powerhead rebuilding is a process that takes patience and great attention to detail neither of which align well with a factory production environment. Additionally, it is imperative that the mechanic doing the final powerhead assembly to the rest of the outboard completely service the fuel, lubrication, and cooling systems prior to selling the engine so that the original problem doesn't reoccur.
It is actually surprising easy to rebuild an outboard that will run reasonably well for a season or two. Rebuilding one to factory-original specs requires a whole different level of commitment and dedication. If you are buying a rebuilt engine from a trusted, well trained and dedicated mechanic, and a list of all parts and procedures used in the rebuild can be supplied, then there is every reason to believe you will have a like-new powerhead going for you. If not, it is a bit of a crap shoot IMO and my preference would be to buy a well-cared for, unmolested machine from a seemingly honest, maintenance-prone individual (if that were to be an option). Even if the latter has a few hundred hours on the clock.
You asked specifically:
Is there anything you can do to test the workmanship of the installation? Would a certified mechanic be able to look at it on the spot and give a general idea on how well it was done or does the engine need tearing into in order to tell?
In case it wasn't already clear from my ramblings above, the actual rebuild and the installation are two separate efforts. The workmanship of neither can be accurately assessed after the fact without complete dissambly or at the very least, lots of receipts and some proof of competance. You can check for proper running, proper and even compression and piston slap. These may all appear to be fine. But still, for an engine to provide a truly long life, precise internal tolerances and torques must be adhered to during the assembly process. If the mechanics involved are unknown, only a complete dissassembly and reassembly would provide this level of confidence.
adlert posted 05-03-2010 10:04 AM ET (US)
Like Butch said! Guess I'm a very slow typist.
NJCoastFlyFish posted 05-06-2010 07:04 AM ET (US)
All,
Thanks for clearing some of that up. I was a little confused on what I was actually looking at in terms of new powerheads/rebuilt engines and so on. You all seem to emphasize that with these rebuilt engines so much weight is on who the rebuilder was. Just like a car mechanic I guess I should shop around for a good marine mechanic.
Also one last question- what is piston slap?
jimh posted 05-06-2010 09:12 AM ET (US)
According to PISTONSLAP.COM--and I am not kidding about that source--piston slap is:
"the secondary (sideways or perpendicular) movement of a piston against the side of a cylinder bore where the primary movement of a piston is intended to be parallel (up and down) to the cylinder bore. All piston driven internal combustion engines and compressors have a certain amount of piston slap."
adlert posted 05-06-2010 09:20 AM ET (US)
Piston slap as I use the term refers to excessive tolerances between the connecting rod and crankpin and/or the connecting rod and wrist pin. Piston slap is also commonly used to describe noises resulting from excessive tolerances between the piston and cylinder wall.
Classic 2-stroke outboards - in particular 2-stroke carbureted outboards - are much more prone to develop piston slap problems than most 4 stroke engines for several reasons. 4 stroke engines operate under varying oil pressures depending on engine speed but at all times the pressure is at least slightly positive. Oil delivery systems in 4-strokes are also somewhat "independent" systems.
2-stroke engines on the othe hand typically operate at an oil pressure of about zero and (prior to direct injection engines) typically require fuel as a carrier for the oil. This setup, coupled with the frequent use of multiple carburetors on a single engine and often long periods of inactivity can lead to fuel/oil delivery restrictions in one or more carbs which then leads to worn bearing and cylinder surfaces associated with restricted carb(s). A reasonably good check for loose pistons is easy.
weekendwarrior posted 05-06-2010 11:15 AM ET (US)
Piston slap is when the piston slaps into the cylinder because it is too loose, usually because the piston and/or cylinder are worn. A common side effect of excessive piston slap is a broken piston skirt (the bottom part of the piston).
As far as rebuilt engines, if you look I am sure you willl see both success and horror stories. It all comes down to the workmanship of the rebuilder.
Tohsgib posted 05-06-2010 11:46 AM ET (US)
Piston slap is easy to hear on a single cyl engine. With 3 or 4 cyls it would be darn impossible. Many outboards sound like they have slap when new.
I would buy the 600 hour engine over a rebuilt.
NJCoastFlyFish posted 05-09-2010 10:35 PM ET (US)
Thank you all for the lesson in piston slap. That was the first time I have heard that term. Interesting
jimh posted 05-10-2010 09:15 PM ET (US)
As I have already mentioned, the primary influence of the reliability of a re-built motor is the person who performs the rebuild, but there are secondary influences that should also be considered. In rebuilding an outboard motor there will be many original components which cannot be reused. Some components like gaskets, O-rings, or seals, should not be reused because they will probably be damaged in the tear down. The more new gaskets, seals, and O-rings used, the more expensive the rebuilt engine cost will be. Other components which were damaged by some malfunction in the engine operation will have to be replaced, and this includes things like piston rings, pistons, connecting rods, and so on.
In re-building an engine there are two possible sources for the new components which will be used: original equipment parts or after-market replacement parts. Generally the original equipment parts will be more expensive. We assume they are equal in quality to the original parts. After-market replacement parts are generally used because they are less expensive, although there may be some after-market parts which are no cheaper than OEM and may be or claim to be better than OEM. Thus the choice of replacement or repairs parts influences the reliability of the rebuilt engine, too. An engine re-built with all new OEM parts, in which every gasket, seal, and O-ring is replaced, will tend to cost more. One would hope that an engine rebuilt with all new OEM parts, however, should be as close to new quality as possible.
Menemsha69 posted 05-11-2010 06:44 AM ET (US)
NJ- When I started on restoring the Menemsha two years ago, I was assured by my marine mechanic that the motor he was putting on the Menemsha would be "good as new" when he was done with the rebuild. Not only did he rebuild the motor a couple of times, but he put on a new powerhead after several failures with the rebuild. After a year of being high and dry waiting for him to "work the bugs out" I found myself in a position to put a new E-TEC on her and did.
The scary part of the rebuild process is that the motor would work well for a sea-trial or two, but wouldn't last. After a few unsucessful sea-trials and a year off the water, you tend to lose confidence in the motor and mechanic, the new E-TEC solved all of that! In fairness to my mechanic, he stuck with it, and did the best he could to make it right. Unfortunately there is nothing that can remedy the "will it start? will it get me home?" psychosis which follows after a few unsuccessful sea trials, and a tow or two, except a new motor.
If you can, spend the extra cash and slap a new motor on her. It's worth the peace of mind! -k
brisboats posted 05-11-2010 08:58 AM ET (US)
I like buying motors that no one has torn into. To some cleaning the carbs is a rebuild, quick hone and ring on one cylinder equals a rebuild, new gasket kit and paint.. well you get the picture. A properly rebuilt engine should however provide similar service to a factory new engine. It is just there are very few outfits that properly rebuild outboard engines.
Oh and I found this in the Southerner's dictionary, definition of piston slap...

Guy walks into the workshop complaining incessantly about his recent engine rebuild. Owner, Bubba picks up a connecting rod with piston attached from the workbench and whacks complaining patron with it = Piston slap.
Brian

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Author	Topic: Reliability of Outboard Motors With Rebuilt Power Head
NJCoastFlyFish	posted 05-02-2010 10:22 AM ET (US) I have been looking around for a used outboard for a 21-foot boat. I want your thoughts on the reliability of a used outboard with a new powerhead. I am having a problem buying an outboard with a new powerhead because there is a reason the power head failed in the first place. Am I wrong? Can a power head actually just fail from normal use? Is that normal after say 1,500-hours, 2,000-hour? I am under the assumption that power heads fail from running hot without oil for an extended period of time. [If] you bought a used outboard that has 1,500-hours on it with a new powerhead that has 0-hours on it, from personal experience, have any of you actually gotten another 1,500-hours out of your new-used outboard before another repair? Do the rest of the systems on the outboard usually fail first and provide more of a headache? Like I said, I am in the process of buying a used outboard but I am a little biased against these new-power-head engines with big price tags. What are your thoughts? Here is a scenario with two outboards, which one would you pick: 1999 Yamaha 150-HP two-cycle 600-hours runs great $2500, or 1999 Yamaha 150-HP two-cycle new 0-hour powerhead, 1,000-hours on rest of engine $4500?
tom976	posted 05-02-2010 11:16 AM ET (US) Engines with new powerheads can be fine for many years. You have to look at it in a different way.We can all relate to cars. Some cars are built and designed better than others--same with outboards. Some cars can go 200,000 miles and still run strong; others not--same with outboards. What matters the most with a car or outboard is maintenance. If [previous owner] kept on top of things that need to get done it'll last. Two-cycle uutboard failures can occur from overheating [due] to lack of lubrication. Somethings things just age or get worn and let go inside. As for the Yamaha motors you listed, [if] those are OX66 motors, they were well designed and reliable motors. Some claim to get a few thousand hours on them. The problem that you have is that those motors never had an internal hour meter on them, so when someone says 600-hours, it [is] like me selling a car with a broken speedometer stuck on 10,000 miles. It might be 10,000 or 210,000. You never know. As for a powerhead that is new, that can last you a long time. The lower unit will need to be serviced or replaced down the road but that [is] [an] $800 item. New they're about $1,200 on [on-line auction websites]) The rebuilt versus new power head can be dicey too. Some define rebuilt as replacing the items that failed; others replace from soup to nuts the internals. All depends on who does it. Generally speaking though a replacement powerhead from places like [online seller] can run around $3000 or so. So if the motor with 0 hours and new power head were $4,500 it [is] not a bad deal. Especially if they'll throw in a one-year warranty. Generally speaking, it it doesn't break within the first year, take care of it and it should last awhile. For the same motor with 600-hours, it may have [unclear], maybe not. For say $1,500 [unclear] might be worth the risk since putting on a new power head would cost you the same if you had to replace the one on the used motor. Hope this helps. One more thing: The one thing that some boaters worry about is reliability especially if going offshore. If you like to go 30-miles off shore, then some would choose a rebuilt motor. If you just like going in the back bays or a few miles out, then the used one might be a better choice. Nobody wants to get stuck 30 miles out with no easy way to get back. Inshore boats with older engines get peace of mind from [towing services]--best $150 you'll spend all year in my opinion.--Tom
jimh	posted 05-02-2010 11:35 AM ET (US) When an outboard motor power head is re-built, you are essentially making a large investment in the skill of the person performing the re-build. If you know the person who performed the re-build of the motor, and if you have confidence in his skill at performing a re-build of an outboard motor, you should not be afraid of buying a motor re-built by that person. If you know nothing about the skill of the person who re-built the motor, you really know nothing about the motor.
NJCoastFlyFish	posted 05-03-2010 07:53 AM ET (US) If two stroke outboards fail from lack of lubrication how do four stroke powerheads fail? If the engine oiling system in a four stroke is a closed system and there is always oil in the engine can the powerhead still fail? Lets say for argument sake you found a nice outboard with a new powerhead but don't know who put the powerhead on. Is there anything you can do to test the workmanship of the installation? Would a certified mechanic be able to look at it on the spot and give a general idea on how well it was done or does the engine need tearing into in order to tell?
Jefecinco	posted 05-03-2010 09:33 AM ET (US) There is a huge difference between a "new" and a "rebuilt" power head. The terms are not interchangeable. A new power head is available from the manufacturer and is from the same assembly line that produces new complete engines. It's as good as new. A rebuilt power head is exactly as described by JimH. It is as good as the person performing the rebuild. If you are ignorant of the source you are ignorant of the result. If a new power head has been installed on an old engine there is a reasonable assumption that it was assembled correctly. It can be examined and tested by a reliable shop for added assurance. If you are nervous about it have it checked out. For a rebuilt power head read the previous paragraph. It is not a reasonable assumption that all outboard engine failures are due to over heating. It is unusual for a four stroke outboard engine to be rebuilt or, if the engine suffered a serious failure, to be repaired. The cost of rebuild or serious internal engine repair of a four stroke outboard engine is much higher than for a two stroke outboard engine. Buying a used engine from an unknown source is a roll of the dice. If I was in the market for a used two stroke the price would have to be low because I would assume I would have to rebuild the engine at any time. An engine with a rebuilt power head would be subject to the same assumption. I could make an exception in the case of an engine from a source well know to me when I knew the engine had had the proper care. Butch
adlert	posted 05-03-2010 10:00 AM ET (US) NJ, Not really. jimh is spot on. Likely the "new" powerhead is not a factory assembled new powerhead but a remanufactured unit. If a factory supplied unit I'd be pleasantly surprised but demand verification. If not the powerhead could have come from a variety of sources, the most likely being one of the many large powerhead rebuilding companies (and then installed by a more local mechanic). Or possibly the local mechanic did the entire rebuilding and installation job him/herself. In principle, a properly rebuilt powerhead is essentially just as good as a new one and should last accordingly. In reality, I feel the large engine rebuilders often do not take the time to assemble their rebuilds to factory original tolerances. At these shops it is reasonably safe to assume that all cylinder walls will be restored as necessary, bearings, seals and pistons will be replaced; but it is not a gaurantee that a so-so crankshaft or connecting rod returned as a core from the last customer won't find its way into the newly rebuilt unit as a cost saving measure to maintain profitability in this very competitive business. I feel that proper powerhead rebuilding is a process that takes patience and great attention to detail neither of which align well with a factory production environment. Additionally, it is imperative that the mechanic doing the final powerhead assembly to the rest of the outboard completely service the fuel, lubrication, and cooling systems prior to selling the engine so that the original problem doesn't reoccur. It is actually surprising easy to rebuild an outboard that will run reasonably well for a season or two. Rebuilding one to factory-original specs requires a whole different level of commitment and dedication. If you are buying a rebuilt engine from a trusted, well trained and dedicated mechanic, and a list of all parts and procedures used in the rebuild can be supplied, then there is every reason to believe you will have a like-new powerhead going for you. If not, it is a bit of a crap shoot IMO and my preference would be to buy a well-cared for, unmolested machine from a seemingly honest, maintenance-prone individual (if that were to be an option). Even if the latter has a few hundred hours on the clock. You asked specifically: Is there anything you can do to test the workmanship of the installation? Would a certified mechanic be able to look at it on the spot and give a general idea on how well it was done or does the engine need tearing into in order to tell? In case it wasn't already clear from my ramblings above, the actual rebuild and the installation are two separate efforts. The workmanship of neither can be accurately assessed after the fact without complete dissambly or at the very least, lots of receipts and some proof of competance. You can check for proper running, proper and even compression and piston slap. These may all appear to be fine. But still, for an engine to provide a truly long life, precise internal tolerances and torques must be adhered to during the assembly process. If the mechanics involved are unknown, only a complete dissassembly and reassembly would provide this level of confidence.
adlert	posted 05-03-2010 10:04 AM ET (US) Like Butch said! Guess I'm a very slow typist.
NJCoastFlyFish	posted 05-06-2010 07:04 AM ET (US) All, Thanks for clearing some of that up. I was a little confused on what I was actually looking at in terms of new powerheads/rebuilt engines and so on. You all seem to emphasize that with these rebuilt engines so much weight is on who the rebuilder was. Just like a car mechanic I guess I should shop around for a good marine mechanic. Also one last question- what is piston slap?
jimh	posted 05-06-2010 09:12 AM ET (US) According to PISTONSLAP.COM--and I am not kidding about that source--piston slap is: "the secondary (sideways or perpendicular) movement of a piston against the side of a cylinder bore where the primary movement of a piston is intended to be parallel (up and down) to the cylinder bore. All piston driven internal combustion engines and compressors have a certain amount of piston slap."
adlert	posted 05-06-2010 09:20 AM ET (US) Piston slap as I use the term refers to excessive tolerances between the connecting rod and crankpin and/or the connecting rod and wrist pin. Piston slap is also commonly used to describe noises resulting from excessive tolerances between the piston and cylinder wall. Classic 2-stroke outboards - in particular 2-stroke carbureted outboards - are much more prone to develop piston slap problems than most 4 stroke engines for several reasons. 4 stroke engines operate under varying oil pressures depending on engine speed but at all times the pressure is at least slightly positive. Oil delivery systems in 4-strokes are also somewhat "independent" systems. 2-stroke engines on the othe hand typically operate at an oil pressure of about zero and (prior to direct injection engines) typically require fuel as a carrier for the oil. This setup, coupled with the frequent use of multiple carburetors on a single engine and often long periods of inactivity can lead to fuel/oil delivery restrictions in one or more carbs which then leads to worn bearing and cylinder surfaces associated with restricted carb(s). A reasonably good check for loose pistons is easy.
weekendwarrior	posted 05-06-2010 11:15 AM ET (US) Piston slap is when the piston slaps into the cylinder because it is too loose, usually because the piston and/or cylinder are worn. A common side effect of excessive piston slap is a broken piston skirt (the bottom part of the piston). As far as rebuilt engines, if you look I am sure you willl see both success and horror stories. It all comes down to the workmanship of the rebuilder.
Tohsgib	posted 05-06-2010 11:46 AM ET (US) Piston slap is easy to hear on a single cyl engine. With 3 or 4 cyls it would be darn impossible. Many outboards sound like they have slap when new. I would buy the 600 hour engine over a rebuilt.
NJCoastFlyFish	posted 05-09-2010 10:35 PM ET (US) Thank you all for the lesson in piston slap. That was the first time I have heard that term. Interesting
jimh	posted 05-10-2010 09:15 PM ET (US) As I have already mentioned, the primary influence of the reliability of a re-built motor is the person who performs the rebuild, but there are secondary influences that should also be considered. In rebuilding an outboard motor there will be many original components which cannot be reused. Some components like gaskets, O-rings, or seals, should not be reused because they will probably be damaged in the tear down. The more new gaskets, seals, and O-rings used, the more expensive the rebuilt engine cost will be. Other components which were damaged by some malfunction in the engine operation will have to be replaced, and this includes things like piston rings, pistons, connecting rods, and so on. In re-building an engine there are two possible sources for the new components which will be used: original equipment parts or after-market replacement parts. Generally the original equipment parts will be more expensive. We assume they are equal in quality to the original parts. After-market replacement parts are generally used because they are less expensive, although there may be some after-market parts which are no cheaper than OEM and may be or claim to be better than OEM. Thus the choice of replacement or repairs parts influences the reliability of the rebuilt engine, too. An engine re-built with all new OEM parts, in which every gasket, seal, and O-ring is replaced, will tend to cost more. One would hope that an engine rebuilt with all new OEM parts, however, should be as close to new quality as possible.
Menemsha69	posted 05-11-2010 06:44 AM ET (US) NJ- When I started on restoring the Menemsha two years ago, I was assured by my marine mechanic that the motor he was putting on the Menemsha would be "good as new" when he was done with the rebuild. Not only did he rebuild the motor a couple of times, but he put on a new powerhead after several failures with the rebuild. After a year of being high and dry waiting for him to "work the bugs out" I found myself in a position to put a new E-TEC on her and did. The scary part of the rebuild process is that the motor would work well for a sea-trial or two, but wouldn't last. After a few unsucessful sea-trials and a year off the water, you tend to lose confidence in the motor and mechanic, the new E-TEC solved all of that! In fairness to my mechanic, he stuck with it, and did the best he could to make it right. Unfortunately there is nothing that can remedy the "will it start? will it get me home?" psychosis which follows after a few unsuccessful sea trials, and a tow or two, except a new motor. If you can, spend the extra cash and slap a new motor on her. It's worth the peace of mind! -k
brisboats	posted 05-11-2010 08:58 AM ET (US) I like buying motors that no one has torn into. To some cleaning the carbs is a rebuild, quick hone and ring on one cylinder equals a rebuild, new gasket kit and paint.. well you get the picture. A properly rebuilt engine should however provide similar service to a factory new engine. It is just there are very few outfits that properly rebuild outboard engines. Oh and I found this in the Southerner's dictionary, definition of piston slap... Guy walks into the workshop complaining incessantly about his recent engine rebuild. Owner, Bubba picks up a connecting rod with piston attached from the workbench and whacks complaining patron with it = Piston slap. Brian