CONTINUOUSWAVE

I ordered a 2023 210 Montauk and took delivery in October 2023.

FIRST DEFECT IN 2023 210 MONTAUK
The boat had multiple cosmetic defects coming out of the factory that the dealer had to repair.

SECOND DEFECT IN 2023 210 MONTAUK
I was out on Lake Michigan with it in May 2023 when the outboard engine began hemorrhaging oil and alarms turned on.

REMEDY PROVIDED
The dealer ended up “buying back” the boat and Boston Whaler agreed to create another build slot for a 2024 210 Montauk for me. I took delivery of the new 2024-model-year 210 MONTAUK in September 2023 and put a few hours on it before I had to put it away for the season.

Now [late May 2024] I’m struggling yet again with manufacturing defects on my 2024 210 Montauk.

FIRST DEFECT IN 2024 210 MONTAUK
My boat is back in the shop because its livewell failed and came unattached. Boston Whaler apparently only uses an adhesive to hold the live well in place and the adhesive failed when I filled it with water. I discovered this when [I finally got the boat back from the dealer while the dealer was working on installing an autopilot for several months], In early during May 2024 I took out the boat and discovered the live well wasn’t working.

SECOND DEFECT IN 2024 210 MONTAUK
The second defect, which was unfortunately not discovered when I took delivery, involves the non-skid. Boston Whaler drilled holes in the wrong place on the gunwale where the aft side rails go, and Boston Whaler then did a mediocre repair before shipping it to the dealer. The dealer tried to repair the non-skid but the repair came out poorly, which they acknowledged. Now the 2024 210 MONTAUK boat has four spots on the aft gunwale that are an eyesore.

THIRD DEFECT IN 2024 MONTAUK 210
I took the boat to the dealer in January 2024 to have autopilot installed. The dealer was not able to complete the job and return it to me until early May 2024, even though they told me the job would be done much earlier. The autopilot is functioning poorly because the autopilot pump has become loose and is able to move around below the deck.

FOURTH DEFECT IN 2024 MONTAUK 210
The hydraulic steering worked poorly and hydraulic fluid was draining in the console. The dealer remedied those problems.

I am upset because of the experience I have had.

Q1: what are my options here?

What I really want to do is get rid of the 2024 210 MONTAUK boat.

I’ve always been a big Boston Whaler fan but I think their quality is lacking and I’m hesitant to ever buy another Boston Whaler boat again because something breaks every time I take one of their boats out on the water.

I especially don’t want non-skid [cosmetic defects].

I’m even considering getting a lawyer. This has cost me too much time and money.

I presume you have already called the factory on the current defects and gotten the Engineering department (NOT customer service) involved on the defects.

Did the factory get involved on the first buyback or was it the dealer?

I would start creating documentation and records for the possible next step.

I would write a log with entries for each and every thing. Include the date, time, names and contact details for EVERYONE you spoke to each and every time. Print out every email, every text. Copy every piece of paper from the dealer.

You can contact me offline for more details on the above.

Phil T--I just recently contacted BostonWhaler technical support. My dealer had apparently reached out to Boston Whaler about the live well defect, but [someone unidentified] said that they [unclear] would handle the non-skid [repair] internally, which bewildered me since they [unclear] already tried repairing it and it came out poorly.

The first buy-back was through the dealer although Boston Whaler was aware of it. It was essentially a trade-in for an identical build that was heavily discounted so I came out even.

Honestly, I’m about to pull my hair out. I don’t know what I can even expect.

Are [Boston Whaler] gonna give me a new boat?

I doubt it. I don’t think they’ll even want to do a buy-back again. The dealer as well as Boston Whaler will always try to protect themselves first and try to make me eat the cost. I don’t know what recourse I have.

How can I contact you offline? I’ll take any advice I can get.

The problems with the installation of an auto-pilot are not related to any defect in the manufacturing of the 2024 210 MONTAUK at Boston Whaler. Those problems are just a result of poor work by the dealer's technicians.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENT] It is very likely that the leaking of hydraulic fluid from the helm is related to the poor installation work done by the dealer with the autopilot, which I have to assume is appropriate as the leaking fluid seems to have occurred after the autopilot was installed.

The problems with the outboard engine that occurred with the 2023 210 MONTAUK (although not specifically identified, must be presumed to be a Brunswick Mercury Marine engine) are not a result of defects in manufacturing by Boston Whaler, but more likely defects in manufacturing by Mercury Marine. Because Boston Whaler and Mercury are actually Brunswick, just operating under separate names, the ultimate responsibility for the engine defects should be taken on by Brunswick. Because the boat was purchased from a dealer as a Boston Whaler boat, then Boston Whaler is perhaps the most reasonable entity of Brunswick to taken responsibility for providing a remedy to whatever manufacturing defect occurred in the Mercury Marine branded engine. Apparently the dealer stepped in for Boston Whaler, Mercury Marine, and Brunswick, and offered you the remedy of a completely new boat at a cost and a time delay you agreed to accept.

The existence of cosmetic defects in the laminate and other workmanship of a new Boston Whaler boat is certainly unanticipated by any buyer, particularly considering the rather premium cost of a Boston Whaler boat. Exactly what protection is provided to the buyer for providing a remedy for cosmetic defects is probably buried in some element of the sales agreement or other paperwork related to the purchase, but any language therein notwithstanding, the natural and reasonable expectation of a buyer of a new, unused, built-to-order Boston Whaler boat is that the workmanship and finish of every part of the boat will be to the highest standards.

I know the problems relating to the installation of the autopilot on my 2024 210 ONTAUK don’t have anything to do with the manufacturer.

The non-skid defects and livewell failure, however, have to do with the manufacturer.

I agree that the manufacturer should provide a product of the highest standard given the price tag.

I paid a premium for these boats and have had nothing but concerns. I lost all of the 2023 boating season and now half of my 2024 boating season is gone because of these problems.

The boat should have been ready to launch in March [2024].

I will recap in a bit more concise manner.

MANUFACTURING DEFECTS

The 2023 MONTAUK 210
The boat was delivered with unspecified cosmetic defects. The engine failed soon after being used. The remedy provided by the dealer was to take back the boat and sell a new 2024 MONTAUK 210 to replace the original 2023 model. The cost of the exchange of boats was apparently favorable to the buyer. The time delay for delivery of the new boat until September 2023 was also apparently agreeable to the buyer.

The 2024 MONTAUK 210
The second new boat was delivered in September 2023. The boat was used "for a few hour" and put away "for the season". In early May 2024 (the next season) the live well was discovered to be loose due to failure of an adhesive. Also some time after delivery, a cosmetic defect (unnecessary screw holes in the non-skid which were not repaired sufficiently to mask their appearance) in the gunwale non-skid was discovered.

DEALER SERVICE WORK FAULTS
At the end of the 2023 boating season dealer tookin the 2024 210 MONTAUK for work to install an autopilot. The work took too long. The pump for the autopilot is not installed properly. The autopilot functions poorly. Likely also caused by the installation of the autopilot is a leak of hydraulic steering fluid at the helm. The dealer repair of the cosmetic defects in the non-skid was not done to the owner's satisfaction. The boat was not available for use until May 2024.

CURRENT SITUATION
The exact status of the 2024 210 MONTAUK is not clear from the narrative.

Q2: Has the live well adhesive defect been repaired?

Q3: Does the live well now work properly?

Q4: Does the autopilot now work properly?

Q5: Has the leak of hydraulic fluid at the helm been repaired?

If the answer to all the above is yes, then the only on-going problem with the boat is the cosmetic defect in the gunwale which permits several unused fastener holes to be visible when the non-skid is inspected and is considered to be not-suitably repaired, although twice attempted.

To better judge the severity of this cosmetic defect, a clear photograph of the non-skid would be very useful. Generally a flaw in the non-skid pattern can only be detected if a very close-up look is taken at the non-skid. If I inspect the non-skid on my 1990 Boston Whaler boat I can find very small flaws in the non-skid pattern in several places, but they are completely unnoticeable when looking at the non-skid from the normal distance of five feet vertical separation. That's why a photograph would help readers appreciate the degree of cosmetic flaw that is represented by these poorly-done repairs.

Regarding the delay in the availability of the boat that occurred between March 2024 and May 2024, and those three months representing "half the boating season", the cause of this delay is the dealer and his slow and perhaps incompetent work to install the auto-pilot. I do not think that Boston Whaler will be likely to offer a remedy or compensation because of the delay in the dealer performing the work you ordered the dealer to do. That delay is entirely on the dealer.

To answer your question, no, the livewell has not been repaired yet. The boat has been sitting in the shop at the dealership for a total of 2 weeks awaiting instructions from Boston Whaler on how to perform a proper warranty repair. In the meanwhile, I can’t use it.

Just to clarify, the dealer attempted to repair the non-skid once. The repair came out poorly and they acknowledged it. They want to work on it again in the off season but I don’t see how it’s going to come out any differently. The original defect consisted of visible “cut-outs” for lack of a better term where the screw holes were replaced with new fiberglass as well as one spot where there was a half inch long crack in the non-skid where one of the screw holes was and a 4 x 6 inch section where the non-skid was shaved/sanded down. After the attempted repair the non-skid is blotchy and discolored. There are still some areas where the original screw holes are visible. The lines on the non-skid don’t match up well. The repair is very poor.

Of course there are small flaws/defects on your old 1990 Boston Whaler. The boat is 34 years old. This one is new and probably cost 100k more. I expect better from Boston Whaler.

Yes, the autopilot and steering have apparently been repaired by the dealer although I haven’t been able to use it yet because they still have it. They spent a significant amount of time doing going through everything again to their credit and told me steering and autopilot were now functioning normally. We’ll see.

There’s another concern for me. As this process drags on, I’m becoming more upset and dissatisfied with Boston Whaler and the dealer. I live in SW Michigan and there are only two dealers nearby.

Do I have to be worried about being “blacklisted” or ignored because I’m “complaining” too much and keep raising my disappointment
with them?

I do worry about that and don’t know if there are any laws or rules protecting me from that.

On the flip side, if I don’t complain or say anything then absolutely nothing gets done like it should.

My two cents: take Phils advice and document your interactions. I also agree with JimH that it seems, that other than the livewell loose adhesive problem, the rest seem to be poor quality work by your dealer. Lastly, I sense a large degree of emotion in your comments and understand that is how from your perspective it feels to be the case.

My recommendation is to largely eliminate that emotional aspect from your conversations with both the dealer and Boston Whaler. Not to mention here on CW as well.

[Boston Whaler's and the dealer's] perspective is a purely business oriented customer satisfaction dilemma that will in the end only cost them time and money. Their reputation in the market may feel one small bump in the road but only a small back road in SW Michigan.

Regarding the minor imperfections in the non-skid I mentioned in my 1990 boat--they are not from old age but were in the originally molded non-skid. They were probably caused either by some small debris on the mold when the gel coat layer was sprayed onto it, or perhaps by some air bubble that got into the gel coat as it was sprayed on. They have been in the non-skid since the day the boat was molded. They just are not particularly visible.

Regarding the repair to damage in a non-skid area, my impression of this sort of work is that the repair requires skill and probably some considerable practice to acquire.

Here is another anecdote from my experience with repair of gel coat patterns in non-skid areas that stems from my boat.

When I bought my boat the seller (located in Ohio) reported that the boat had been purchased for his father to use in Florida, but as things turned out, the boat was now for sale because, again according to the seller. "it was too much for my father to handle." The seller was in the boat business, but he was handling this sale as a private sale (and his name was on the boat title and on the engine title, as outboard engines are titled in Ohio).

I interpreted the seller's remark to mean that the father probably had gotten into some situation where he lost control of the boat in some manner. My presumption was he might have come into a dock and smacked the bow platform hard against something that was not going to move. The reason for that was the alignment of the bow platform was just ever so slightly skewed a bit to one side instead of being perfectly aligned with the keel. This was a very minor deviation, and it never bothered me, but it was part of what I assumed might have happened with an older guy trying to handle the boat, which, by the way, with the bow pulpit, Whaler Drive, and the outboard engine is almost 30-feet long, and maneuvering it with a single engine with any high winds with the canvas up can get a bit perilous in the fairway of a marina.

About ten years after I bought the boat, one nice sunny day in the Spring I was standing on the foredeck washing off the dirt and bugs, and suddenly I noticed something that I had never seen before: there were four areas on the foredeck where a circular repair of a diameter about the same as the circular base mounts for the rather long bow pulpit railing must have once been. (On this boat the bow pulpit railing extends from the peak of the bow pulpit back to the cockpit raised coaming at the helm and there are six vertical rail stanchions fastened to the deck.) These repairs had remained invisible for many years, but over time there must have been some slight shrinking of the resin that was used, and a slight difference in color as the repair resin was exposed to sunlight compared to the original gel coat on the boat, and these repairs became visible--if the lighting was right and you looked hard to see them.

My inference from this late appearance of the repairs on the foredeck now reinforced my speculation that the previous user--the father of the seller--must have had some encounter of boat-versus-dock where the original bow pulpit railing was badly damaged. The bow pulpit railing on the boat is pristine, and has no sign of damage so I assume it must have been a replacement railing, but the location of the four of vertical rail bases is slightly different from what must have been for the original railing bases, as the newly-come-into-view repaired areas on the deck seemed to indicate as they were offset from the existing rail bases by a few inches.

I know this is along story, but the point of it is that making totally invisible repairs in a gel coat area that has a non-skid pattern is just about impossible, and even if done initially to the point of total invisibility, a perfect repair might not age in the identical manner as the original gel coat and ten or 20 years later it could show up.

Getting back to the 2024 210 MONTAUK boat that is under discussion, without actually seeing the repaired gunwales in person or in a truly representative photograph of them, to judge whether the existence of these repairs justifies some further compensation from the dealer or the boat builder is impossible to say.

If the repairs are really lame and look like crap, that is one situation.

If the repairs are only visible if you look for them, that is another situation.

What would I do next? I would get out the sales contract and the manufacturer's warranty statement, and read both very carefully to see exactly what remedies are specified to be provided for cosmetic defects.

Also, we are talking about a fiberglass center console 21-foot boat. Yes, these boats are very expensive. But we are not talking about an art object whose finish is supposed to be completely flawless.

Thank you for the advice.

I’m documenting everything and have involved Whaler technical support myself. I don’t have the pictures of the non-skid right now because the dealer has my boat. I understand you can’t make a judgment without seeing it in a picture. I’m happy to post a picture when I get a chance to. Suffice it to say it is looks crappy and the dealer themselves acknowledged it.

I hear what you’re saying about the emotional aspect. Yes, I’m upset. I spent a lot of money on two Boston Whalers because I counted on the quality of their boats and their reputation. I can hardly even get on the water because the boats keep failing in one way or another, requiring warranty repairs, before they even hit 20 hours. I’d be better off if I just stuck with a used Whaler. Your advice is well taken, however.

For the record, I’ve been a staunch Whaler fan ever since I set foot aboard one sometime around 2010. Unfortunately I have had a poor experience the last two years.

Call Boston Whaler and ask to speak with the head of Marketing.

If you get that guy--at least someone in Marketing--ask them this question:

Would you exhibit my 210 MONTAUK at the Miami Boat Show or some other major boat show, knowing that there were poorly repaired screw fastener holes left over from installation of the side railings and the live well option was installed and was loose?

My wild guess hypothesis about how the several minor problems came about in your 210 MONTAUK: Boston Whaler has so many $1-million boats on back order, that the best, most experienced guys in their boat molding and assembly operation are working on those boats, and the people building the smaller boats like a 210 MONTAUK are newer employees what are not quite as skilled.

If you can't get the defects fixed in a timely fashion, find a local shop that does good work and have the dealer pay the bill.

Loosing a season of boating due to their delay should be expensive for them. ie. CASH.

You should be able to use the boat while you wait for the livewell fix.

I presume you are making principle and interest payments on the boat while it is unavailable.

My philosophy is polite but firm. Document, explain, ask detailed neutral toned questions. Put them in the position of having to defend their answers and not have you being "patient and understanding"

I have read and spoken to several really irate owners who had the occasional lemon. It happens. You are not going to be black balled.

In today's social-media-share-everything world, businesses can get crushed and loose millions in value by a person on Tic Tok or whatever platform.

On the WHALER.COM website I just priced a 2024 210 MONTAUK. WIth NO options the MSRP is $77,000. I can see why at that price there could be a lot of disappointment in a new boat that is delivered to the buyer with cosmetic defects that cannot be fixed, loose components, and an engine that does not last one season.

A REPORT OF DEFECTS SEEN ON NEW BOSTON WHALER BOATS

While visiting a Boston Whaler dealer on June 9, 2024, I looked at some of the smaller Boston Whaler boats on display outdoors, including MONTAUK boats models 150, 170 and 210. In my rather quick look-over of these new Boston Whaler MONTAUK boats I noticed some imperfections. A common defect among the boats was the fastening of various items; the most concerning was a bracket holding a SONAR transducer was loose and showed no evidence of being sealed. But overall these boats looked fairly good, but I really did not do a detailed inspection of them.

More troubling was the hull gel coat on a larger OUTRAGE boat. I could see the impression of fiberglass mat coming through in the gel coat. While I have seen defects like this on lower-tier boats from other boat builders, I have never before seen gel coat like this on Boston Whaler. I was very surprised. I did not have a camera with me, so I have no photographs.

Ass occurred in many manufactured products in the post-COVID era marked by increased demand by consumers, perhaps Boston Whaler--like other companies [not named]--has cut corners in their manufacturing in order to meet demand.

Perhaps the two 170 MONTAUK boats and the Mercury Marine engine being discussed in this thread were rushed out the door, resulting in the problems reported.

Of the problems mentioned, the gel coat flaws are the worst--in my opinion-- because those blemishes, even if repaired to look like new, will probably discolor over time as they were not done at the time of the original hull moldings. On all the Boston Whaler boats I have owned, gel coat repairs, which initially matched darn well, later faded or discolored and no longer matched the original gel coat.

The solution [for the gel coat flaws] is to have them redone, or move on and live with the flaws. Moving-on is more easily done with a five-year-old boat than with a new boat. And after 30 years, to make a repair to replace discolored gelcoat that is still good in all other areas than the color match is even more difficult to rationalize.

The next time I have an opportunity to drop in at a local Boston Whaler dealer, I will also take a look at the boats on exhibit to see if I notice any visual evidence of a manufacturing defect. But in all the times in the past I have looked at new Boston Whaler boats at a dealer, I have never seen any defects that could be detected by a casual visual inspection.