Cable-Tie Base Mounting Choice: Adhesive or Screw Fastener

[hunterc4]

Q1: what is a safe depth one can screw into the center console fiberglass [of 2001 Dauntless 180] without penetrating [through to the exterior]?

BACK STORY
I'm cleaning up the wiring inside the center console of my 2001 Dauntless 180. I would like to use 3M adhesive cable tie bases, but I'm worried the adhesive mounts will fail when the Louisiana sun continuously turns my console into an oven. I'm also concerned that using screw-in mounts with self-tapping that might penetrate the laminate and break out on the exterior of the console.

3M Adhesive mounts: https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/3M-Electronic-Specialty/06292?qs=2QeNe8YlJQaeUyPfl1lF1A%3D%3D

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/1/3M_3f_Cable_Ties___Data_Sheet___78_8125_9860_1_N-51088.pdf

[Real 3M mounts are rated for 18-lbs tensile strength. See data sheet.--Moderator]

No-brand screw-in-place mounts:https://www.amazon.com/Cable-Mounts-Black-Tapping-Screw/dp/B0CXM5QJ8Q/

[Phil T]

Adhesive mounts will not last more than a year.

A screw-in mount is recommended with a short, i.e. 3/8" or less, screw. Select an area that has the wood reinforcement/backer. Insert sealant (not adhesive) into the hole prior to the screw.

[jimh]

Exactly how many inches apart are you planning on installing cable-tie bases in the wiring in the console of your 2001 180 DAUNTLESS?

Electrical wiring should be done neatly, but it should not be viewed as an art object. I much prefer to keep bundles of wires attached together somewhat loosely so there is always room for one more wire to be added or room to wiggle a wire to identify where it goes or came from. If a bundle sags a small amount between points where it is fixed in place to the bulkhead, there is no particular crime or harm occurring. Electrically there won't be any difference, and, in fact, more loosely bound cables will shed heat better.

If you clean the fiberglass with acetone before attaching the adhesive cable tie bases, I would expect they will have better bond with the laminate. As long as there is no dirt and the two surfaces are completely clean, the bond should be good. Of course, do not expect them to hold up 2-AWG conductors over a span of several feet. Use real 3M products.

If you are extremely concerned that the adhesive might fail, then you could use a through-bolted mount at periodic spacing to better retain the mount to the interior wall of the console. On the exterior use a oval head screw with a finishing washer. On the interior use a Ny-lock hex nut. This is important to retain the nut when there is a lot of vibration.

I would be extraordinarily careful if you think you can use a self-tapping screw and get the precise length to not break through the console laminate to the exterior gel coat layer. Using self-tapping screws always puts stress on the laminate and you could easily crack the gel coat if the screw point gets anywhere close to it. Since you are "cleaning up" mostly for visual reasons, you are going to hate seeing any stress cracks in the exterior gel coat of the console.

[hunterc4]

I probably was considering [the cleaning up of the wiring] to be too much of an "art project." I'll take a look at what I have already screwed in, and try to reuse the hardware already there. Then I'll reinforce some runs with the adhesive backing mounts, as needed, and see how they hold up.

[fno]

So I've been using cable ties and bases for more than 40 years. Two important things to note. Cable ties are only as good as the head that it comes with. Most cheap ones use the molded plastic catch to secure the cable tie. Better ones (Thomas & Betts, Panduit) use a stainless steel catch that almost never fails. As for bases, the only place I have seen them last more than 12 months is in air conditioned electrical cabinets with little to no moisture or heat inside. As for your console, I would suspect that the glass thickness ranges from 1/8" to 3/4" if there is backer board embedded in the glass. Following existing wiring is always a good choice and lands bases in the right places.

Last piece of advice, never use a pair of side cutters (diagonal cutters) to trim cable tie ends unless they are flush cutting electronics cutters. Reason is you will invariably trim a cable tie on an angle and create a small very sharp knife to cut your hands and or arms at a later date. I'm not talking Band-Aid cuts, mine were 3-inch to 6-inch lacerations that required stitches. This was from dealer modifications. Boston Whaler employees use cable tie cutters that cut flush and square to the head. Cable tie cutters are often found at Home Depot or Lowes for not that much money. I'm also quite sure if you go for a better offering from Amazon you will get decent quality. Get the pistol shaped type and not the T-shaped ones (they are crap) My work cutters from Thomas and Betts are adjustable for different size cable ties, rotate, and are comfortable for a full days use. They also cost $375 but work pays for them. The ones I mentioned before should cost no more than $25 to $30.

[jimh]

Below in Figure 1 is a screen capture from a broadcast of the launch of the Cygnus Spacecraft by SpaceX (from Saturday, August 3, 2024). The scene is just before the Cygnus will separate from the second stage of the SpaceX rocket. When I saw this I was intrigued by the use of cable ties to retain electrical cables to the body of the Falcon9 second stage, and the spacing between those cable ties.

Fig. 1. View of cable ties (blue) retaining electrical cables [silver-white) in place on the SpaceX Falcon 9 second stage, at the launcher mechanism.

cygnusSpacecraft.jpg (97.78 KiB) Viewed 13882 times

The blue cable ties must be quite specially rated. The temperature range in space can be extremely wide, varying from hot in sunlight to extreme cold in darkness. The resistance to vibration must also be excellent, as I am sure the ride into space atop a Falcon9 rocket creates considerable forces.

I suspect the long span between cable ties is perhaps related to saving weight and to the simple-is-better concept.

[jimh]

My usual method of installing a cable tie around a cable bundle is to make two loops, pull the cable tie moderately tight, then cut off the excess with a very small diagonal cutter, laying the cutter flush with the head of the cable tie. This results in an almost perfectly flush and square cut.

The reason for the two loops is I know sometime in the not very distant future I will have to work on that area again, and if I have to remove a cable tie, I just cut the table tie as close as possible to the head. This leaves a length of cable tie that can be re-used if reduced to just one loop. If I have to cut off a one-loop cable tie, I again cut it right at the head where the far end is returning to the head to be locked in place; in this way I get a re-usable cable tie that is only about a quarter-inch shorter than the original.

Doing this is not so much because I want to save money, but on the boat I might not have dozens of new tie-wraps on hand, so I save everyone I can for re-use.